The Unseen Servant forums

Posted: **Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:49 pm**

Stonjuz wrote:I think my character sheet is complete for the most part. Now my question is Thac0. How and where would you like them.

I have been working on my 'combat' rules off-and-on for the last couple of days and hope to be in a position to start formally posting them today... however, I will share a few nuggets below (with the disclaimer that everything is still tentative at this point):

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I had never used THAC0 before (and understand it gets a bad rap by many), but after looking at it, I'm not sure why? (Anyone can feel free to share their thoughts on this if they feel strongly the other way.)

The below is a sneak peak at my 'attack roll' rules:

Attack Rolls
This game will be using the Calculated THAC0 table from 2E in combat situations. The progression is smoother and more realistic than the Attach Charts presented in the 1E DMG, pages 74-75. In fact, if the following 'Special Note Regarding Fighters' Progression' rules from the 1E DMG are applied, the Attack Charts (1E) and THAC0 progression charts (2E) are nearly identical.

1E DMG, page 74 wrote:Special Note Regarding Fighters' Progression: This table is designed to allow fighters to advance by 5% per level of experience attained, rather than 10% every 2 levels, if you believe that such will be helpful in your particular campaign. If you opt for a per level advancement in combat ability, simply use the table but give a +1 "to hit" bonus to fighters who attain the second level of experience shown in each group of 2 levels, i.e. 1-2, 3-4, etc. You may, of course, elect not to allow per level combat advancement.

In any system, if the final, modified die roll on 1d20 is equal to or greater than the number needed to hit the target, the attack succeeds. If the roll is lower than that needed, the attack fails.

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However, that also serves as a segue into my 'damage roll' rules:

Damage Rolls
There will be known combat modifiers (e.g. Strength bonuses, weapon bonuses, etc...), but there may also be unknown modifiers applied by the DM before determining whether or not a posted attack roll actually hits. For this reason, always post the results of a damage roll any time you make an attack roll (unless you roll a natural '1' which will always miss).

Note: These attack and damage rolls may be combined, see: 'Die-roll macro syntax and rules'. For example:

Code: Select all

To hit: [1d20+1], damage with mace: [1d6+2]

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It's the there may also be unknown modifiers applied by the DM before determining whether or not a posted attack roll actually hits line that is really important in this conversation. It's great for you, as a player, to be aware of what your THAC0 and known modifiers (e.g. strength bonus) are, but attack rolls may be subject to unknown modifiers as well.

Bottom line, short of rolling a natural-20, a player can never be truly certain whether or not their attack roll hits.

Posted: **Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:51 pm**

onlyme wrote:Over the last few years, I find it easier to name the teams I root against, than whom I root for.
Dallas, NYGiants... the rest become interchangeable depending on the situation.

Not a fan of the NFC East, I take it... or, a fan of a different NFC East team.

Hmmm...

Posted: **Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:53 pm**

Alethan wrote:Something tells me this isn't going to be something we need to worry about (i.e. dmw71 is going to keep track of what hits and what misses). Just roll the dice and hope they're high.

Alethan wrote:On the only-slightly minor tangent of rolling damage, I'm quite happy with getting rid of the whole "dmg vs. small/medium" and "dmg vs. large" bit. Makes my dice rolling macros much easier to organize and sort when I don't have to worry if the creature is of the medium or larger variety.

As am I. I've always felt that varying damage by opponent size rule was silly.

Posted: **Fri Sep 14, 2012 4:02 pm**

Alethan wrote:You forgot your cod piece! Can't be very cavalier about anything if you're running around without yer cod piece!

D'oh! How could I have forgotten that?!

Alethan wrote:So you would definitely prefer a written-out character sheet over (or in addition to) the Dice Roller one?

I would, yes. I admit to dropping the ball on getting the templates out there as quickly as I mentioned I might be able to. It's unfortunate that formatting spaces are lost on these boards or it would be so much easier. I'm still struggling a bit with organizing where I want all the various pieces of information... I'll get there.

I've asked about the text formatting earlier (Text Formatting) and it's likely to be an "it is what it is" condition, so you'll notice that I've been using a lot of the

Code: Select all

 tag when posting items that require their formatting to stay intact.

[/tangent]

Anyway, yes, I would prefer to have a text character sheet.  Players should feel free to also use the built-in character sheet from the die roller, but if you do so, please make sure both sheets (die roller) and text get updated when changes are made.

Posted: **Fri Sep 14, 2012 4:19 pm**

dmw71 wrote: Anyway, yes, I would prefer to have a text character sheet. Players should feel free to also use the built-in character sheet from the die roller, but if you do so, please make sure both sheets (die roller) and text get updated when changes are made.

I'm not terribly keen on updating in more than one place, so I'll probably just scratch the Dice Roller format and go manual on the Character thread.

Posted: **Fri Sep 14, 2012 4:27 pm**

Alethan wrote:I'm not terribly keen on updating in more than one place, so I'll probably just scratch the Dice Roller format and go manual on the Character thread.

Actually, before you go and scrap what you have... don't worry about it.

Upon further consideration, I'm not necessarily interested in having everything listed on this text character sheet... just the key things.Let me give this some thought. Instead of my working on a handful of different variations of character sheets, basically the containing the same information, I will instead just create a single, high-level sheet for each player to fill out.

On this sheet will be the basic information I am interested in always having on hand:

Ability scores
Hit points
Expendables (e.g. food, light sources, material spell components, etc...)
Etc...

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So, bottom line, feel free to keep what you have in place. Sorry!

Posted: **Fri Sep 14, 2012 4:57 pm**

I was just going to remove the link, not scrap the content.

I'm not daft.

Posted: **Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:21 pm**

Dave I'm a fan of thaco - always used it (back in the day started in becmi then moved to a 1e / 2e hybrid that used it). Its simple and I think makes combat easy. However I'm a bit of a mathematician that may help. Never realised there was any dislike for it before getting on dragonsfoot about 6mths ago....

Posted: **Sun Sep 16, 2012 11:33 pm**

Even the old guard has incorporated thac0 into their games. When Tim Kask (OD&D Editor) came to my house to run one of his games, I thought there would be a blood fued with some of my players. We are all 2.5 players and we didnt have time or desire to learn a different system. Turns out Tim has used thac0 for a long while now (he left TSR long before thac0 came out). Now if I can just get him to adjust his weapon tables......(different question)

Posted: **Mon Sep 17, 2012 12:42 am**

saalaria wrote:Dave I'm a fan of thaco - always used it (back in the day started in becmi then moved to a 1e / 2e hybrid that used it). Its simple and I think makes combat easy. However I'm a bit of a mathematician that may help. Never realised there was any dislike for it before getting on dragonsfoot about 6mths ago....

I'm glad to hear it. I check out Dragonsfoot occasionally (I used to post game journals there for an old face-to-face game I tried for a few weeks -- Thru the Ashes) and there seems to a decent amount of dislike for it, which I really don't understand. Maybe it's just possible resentment from it not being an original Gygax/Arneson creation?

The progressions are close, but they're more fluid in the THAC0 system, which I like. So, we'll be using it here and see how it goes.

Posted: **Mon Sep 17, 2012 12:43 am**

Stonjuz wrote:When Tim Kask (OD&D Editor) came to my house to run one of his games

Nice!

Also cool to hear that he was using THAC0, too.

Posted: **Mon Sep 17, 2012 1:14 am**

I'll repost his post from Dragonsfoot. I know I'll never forget it.
viewtopic.php?p=15429#p15429

Posted: **Sat Sep 22, 2012 2:51 am**

I know my PC weights are screwy formatted. I havent had a chance to update them to the new rules. my work laptop is out of commission for the last couple days through Monday AM... so, trying to do things on kindle...

Posted: **Sat Sep 22, 2012 3:23 am**

onlyme wrote:I know my PC weights are screwy formatted. I havent had a chance to update them to the new rules. my work laptop is out of commission for the last couple days through Monday AM... so, trying to do things on kindle...

I agree that reading through your equipment wasn't the easiest, but it's all accurate. The nice thing, especially for you as you're probably carrying more equipment than most, is that most of what is listed rolls into the 'Adventuring Gear' category. I didn't even bother to sum everything, but it all seemed pretty reasonable to me and the collection will weigh you down 20 pounds. You're comfortably under your 12" modified movement rate. You're good.

Posted: **Sat Sep 22, 2012 2:37 pm**

dmw71 wrote:
onlyme wrote:I know my PC weights are screwy formatted. I havent had a chance to update them to the new rules. my work laptop is out of commission for the last couple days through Monday AM... so, trying to do things on kindle...
I agree that reading through your equipment wasn't the easiest, but it's all accurate. The nice thing, especially for you as you're probably carrying more equipment than most, is that most of what is listed rolls into the 'Adventuring Gear' category. I didn't even bother to sum everything, but it all seemed pretty reasonable to me and the collection will weigh you down 20 pounds. You're comfortably under your 12" modified movement rate. You're good.

It's funny, but if you quote my character sheet, the columns line up right. But once posted, they go back...

Anyway. I had that url listed at the bottom of my sheet. Not sure if you posted that before or after I did it last night...

Is there anything we are missing as a group? and from a practicality standpoint, how would one carry a lance and a pick at same time? Is one holstered behind back? I see one being like a walking stick, but not both. Especially with shield...

Posted: **Sat Sep 22, 2012 4:17 pm**

onlyme wrote:It's funny, but if you quote my character sheet, the columns line up right. But once posted, they go back...

My biggest challenge when it comes to these forums is the formatting. When formatting is important, I wrap the section in the

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 tag; it wraps everything up in what looks like a quote, but at least it preserves the formatting.

[quote="onlyme"]I had that url listed at the bottom of my sheet. Not sure if you posted that before or after I did it last night...[/quote]As long as it's there (which it is), we're good... thanks!

[quote="onlyme"]and from a practicality standpoint, how would one carry a lance and a pick at same time? Is one holstered behind back? I see one being like a walking stick, but not both. Especially with shield...[/quote]It's a lot to carry, but it is possible.  From your character sheet:
[i]in Hand Light Horse lance
around hip Pick, Footman's
around hip Long sword[/i]

The lance would be carried in the hand opposite your shield and the pick and long sword would be attached to opposite sides of your body, either to your hip or your back somehow.  

[quote="onlyme"]Is there anything we are missing as a group?[/quote]The only thing I'm still not sure of is whether or not any characters are going to begin the game knowing each other and in the same group, or if everyone will be starting the game solo.

Posted: **Sat Sep 22, 2012 8:52 pm**

I'm fine solo.

Posted: **Wed Sep 26, 2012 1:30 pm**

Argh!

There are unread threads on this topic. BUT I CAN'T READ THEM!!!

The pain! It hurts!

Posted: **Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:44 pm**

Alethan wrote:Argh!

There are unread threads on this topic. BUT I CAN'T READ THEM!!!

The pain! It hurts!

Sorry! Short of having ToniXX set up four new threads to potentially be used only temporarily, I figured setting it up this way was the best option.

Be strong.

Posted: **Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:59 pm**

dmw71 wrote:
Alethan wrote:Argh!

There are unread threads on this topic. BUT I CAN'T READ THEM!!!

The pain! It hurts!
Sorry! Short of having ToniXX set up four new threads to potentially be used only temporarily, I figured setting it up this way was the best option.

Be strong.

...hurts...

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