Marullus wrote:- 200 sp (20lbs, one small sack)
- a brass brooch with the image of runes in Elvish, and an octopus within a triangle. (20gp sale value)
- a beautiful copper periapt with the image of a skull encased in flame and set with three Moonstones. (600gp object d'art)
- a golden pitcher, covered in a wave-like pattern of etched lines. It is of marvelous workmanship. (Magic Item - 4001xp.)
- 5 fire beetle glow-organs (10gp each to the potion-maker, 50gp)
- Silver demon mask with golden horns (70gp value in materials, weights 52lbs, 350gp as object d'art)
That's 1110 gp plus one magic item if we can get face value for the objects d'art. What are the odds of that?
Also, at the risk of self-promotion, Finger's shop offers scrying for 500 gp. Would it be worth that much to get a better map, see what's going on in the room that might be full of blood, and get a better idea what's down there in general?
viewtopic.php?f=356&t=5485#p246567 Merchant's Camp:
- They are keen to purchase treasures unearthed here which could be resold to the south. For stranger items, they offer a low-cost purchase now, or a higher-price consignment option - if you are willing to wait to be paid and thus share the risk, there is greater potential in the reward. (I will provide the appraised value. They will purchase objects d'art immediately for 25% of appraised value. Or, they will take it on commission and return in three months (10% chance of loss) and offer you 71-130% of appraised value, depending how well it sold.)
* If the value is under 100gp, they pay you full price.
* NPC party members will accept objects d'art at full price in their share.
* Anyone with an object d'art can give it to an NPC to pay for something using its full value, but doesn't get change (usually best for construction projects).
* If you need to divide it at today's cash value, either use the 25% or as a group accept the consignment risk.
Pendleton surveys the loot. 90 gp worth of coin or items easily convertible to coin, a periapt that's theoretically worth 600 gp but will bring only 150 in quick coin, the big demon mask that's worth either 350 gp or 70 gp, and a magic pitcher. Total value: somewhere between 310 gp and who the hell knows? 4,000 gp, more or less?
"I have no idea how to divide this evenly," he admits. "Gentlemen, I have a radical suggestion: let us not try. I believe our next task is set for us: we have to close the hell mouth. Instead of divvying what meager and/or cumbersome spoils we have accumulated, I propose that we use what funds and services we can purchase with these items to prepare for our return to finish what we started. I would suggest, as a start, that we load up on as much holy water as we can carry."
He clears his throat, giving prelude to a forthcoming speech. He looks slightly uncomfortable. "Speaking of our return, I feel obligated to return with you. But I am beyond useless in that place. My sleep spell does not produce drowsiness in the half-heads and they see right past my invisibility incantation. I can understand languages and read magic, but neither skill has yet to prove necessary against the demons. As for my blade, well." He chuckles sourly. "If you are relying on my blade to defeat those things, we might as well start off south now, because we're screwed."
"I need some way to contribute to the cause. Learning additional spells would be a capital beginning, and I hope that eventually my Societus Arcanaeum will prove productive in that regard. But that's a long-term goal. Short term, I see no one offering to trade spells, and Mr. Pierpont's selection of scrolls is entirely too duplicative of the clerical repertoire. And I am afraid that your Brother Mylo finds me insufficiently virtuous to be trusted with the secrets of creating light, casting magic missiles, or the other spells they could teach if they were willing."
"In short, gentlemen, and putting no fine point on it: If I am to be of any further use, I need your help convincing Brother Mylo to allow me to purchase instruction in some of his infirmary's spells. It would be for the good of the party and the good of Gaul. And I would humbly submit that my services against the infernal, both in our recent endeavor and in helping to convict the possessed Bremen, might merit me some measure of special dispensation."
Neegan- Pendleton you have my support anything that will help us defeat the demon spawn.
Neegan will stay at the infirmary till they depart for the demon hole again or the 3 weeks limit is up.
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"If one of you who are faithful to Eruanna would speak on my behalf, or at least ask Brother Mylo to hear me out, it would be immensely helpful," presses Pendleton.
Okay. To avoid getting stuck in treasure-split limbo, here's what I suggest. We have 90 gp in coin, 950 gp in stuff we can use to build or buy, and the magic pitcher. I propose we use the big items to prepare for the return trip as follows:
Periapt: use to purchase 24 flasks of holy water from the Temple of Eruanna
Demon mask: Offer it to Fingers for payment to use the crystal ball*
Pitcher: Hold on to it for now if we think it might be useful, and distribute as loot on the next return to town:
Coin: Split 7 ways (12 gp, 8 sp, 5cp) each (with 5 copper left over).
Thoughts?
* I realize this is self-dealing, but I do think that being able to look at the dungeon without being attacked at the same time is useful. Whether the price is fair is something I'm in a weird position to negotiate. If anyone has ideas on how to deal with this, I'd appreciate it.
Able points out that he gave each party member 5 flasks of holy water when they entered that morning. He retrieved the unused flasks from Grimble and Idriss. I'm down to 2 now, on account of givin' Neegan so many baths, but I can make more. We just need more flasks. Maybe a keg'r two of holy water t'bring along too? Let's use the saved coin t'help the good folks of Gaul. He offers to put in a good word with Brother Mylo on Pendleton's behalf.
He asks Dolph if he would consider returning to finish what they started.
As I pointed out in my outcaste forum, I don't have access to the rulebook until Monday. Marullus, can you roll recruitment? (He's Idriss's NPC anyhow. But Able will try to recruit him now.)
I'm fine spending the money as Zhym suggested, though Dolph needs paying first. Then but a few more flasks and a keg or two to fill with holy water. Let's use Fingers' services, I guess. Knowing more about the dungeon would be nice.
Able will try to recruit another Templar to go, I think. Are Pendleton, Neegan or Dare interested in taking the Templar vows are they? Because, to be honest, any character without Protection from Evil is a major liability. Able, Dolph and Idriss spent the entire adventure as blockers or carrying unconscious people to safety.
I'd love to go back in invisible (to avoid the goblins), with maybe one not protected character at most. Able can cast PfE a few times/day, which could help one PC. But that takes up spell slots.
Pendleton is neither eligible nor interested in becoming a Templar of Eruanna. I considered it as a way of getting spells, but the vow of poverty would interfere with any plans to build a wizard tower for the Societus Arcanaeum. Nor is it philosophically compatible with Pendleton's world view. Sure, he's been fighting demons a lot lately, and he prosecuted Bremen's infernal dealings in court, but there's a difference between developing a specialty and joining the cause as a true believer.
Pendleton has the PfE warding effect available 1/day. He could have it as a permanent effect if I decide to do that with his item XP.
Marullus: with Idriss turned NPC, could Pendleton make a charisma-based attempt to ask Idriss to exchange spells? At least that way we could still have the spells we had with Idriss in the party. Pendleton would offer to swap spell for spell, or to pay Idriss what the Temple of Eruanna is charging for the spells.
ETA: Y'know, what we need is a way to fire holy water at range. A Holy Water Pistol!
19 August 2021
You spend some time transcribing spells and recruiting among the small cadre of Templars here in Gaul.
Idriss isn't permanently an NPC; his player is just traveling the Old Silk Road without wifi. He won't trade his unique spells, but he'll help you transcribe those obtainable through the Templars. You can aquire Protection Evil, Light, Magic Missile for 50gp each (cost of ink).
(Assuming you cash out his share of the expedition)Brother Dolph Gundanar agrees to return with you under Ablesforth's leadership. "The job needs finishing. This time, we need to get to the end and get it done."
Ablesforth speaks to Brother Mylo about taking more experienced Templars to deal with this sinister threat. As the ramifications have had such impact on the temple and the Eruannans are threatened with exile from the city due to the clergy of Baudh's accusations, he agrees. "Two are willing to go with you, as the threat of true demon gate is perillous."
Marullus wrote:19 August 2021
You spend some time transcribing spells and recruiting among the small cadre of Templars here in Gaul.
Idriss isn't permanently an NPC; his player is just traveling the Old Silk Road without wifi. He won't trade his unique spells, but he'll help you transcribe those obtainable through the Templars. You can aquire Protection Evil, Light, Magic Missile for 50gp each (cost of ink).
Thanks. Do I need to record that anywhere other than here? If not, I'll add the spells and deduct the 15 pp.
With the horrors of the Demon Hole temporarily behind him, Able addresses the group. Look here, all, I've got some truthin' to do.
I appreciate whatcha all did down there, puttin' yer lives and souls on the line. But Dolph, Idriss an' me spent most of our time protectin' y'ins instead of dealing with the Evil down there. Which was right, because we didn't know what t'expect then. But now it's all worse. I aim to put it all right, an' I can't do that while worrying over the lot of you. So unless you can ward away them sniffers on yer own, I don't want ya t'return with me. He acknowledges that he cannot prevent folks from going back, either, and warns that if any of them decides to return, they do so at their own risk.
Zhym, how long does PfE last? How many times per day does Pendleton need it cast for a full day's coverage? 6?
"If I had any sense, I'd take your invitation to stay home," answers Pendleton. "But we have unfinished business down there. Besides, there might be spell books."
"I think I should be safe from demonic contact now, as long as I refrain from attacking. And I have done what I can to supplement my spell library. Still, I expect to be fairly useless in combat, so if you have a problem with me spending most of my time hiding behind you and your Templars, now would be the time to tell me."
PfE lasts 12 turns, whether cast by a cleric or an MU. So 24 hours of coverage would take 12 castings.
Do we have any idea how long our latest excursion into the demon hole lasted?
Pendleton could have saved a lot of money by not trying to be useful on a return trip. Able isn't exactly convincing him to put his own self-interest aside, is what I'm saying.
We were there for a day on the second outing, but then the game clock advanced a week, at least. So your ring should be reactivated now.
Because Pendleton had some of his own protection, Able can (and will) augment that with some spells of his own. He just can't protect a whole party again. Maybe I misread it and overreacting, but it seemed the sniffers were endless and the party was in danger of being killed constantly by regenerating demons. What was your take? Maybe we just had poor wandering monster rolls...
No, that's my impression as well. But Pendleton is able to protect himself now. His ring provides constant warding against the infernal as long as Pendleton doesn't attack. If he does attack, the protection drops for the current scene. Pendleton also knows PfE. So he can protect himself magically.
I think we need to figure out, when we go down, whether we take on each group of sniffers head-on or try to move past them. For the first, we don't need everyone to have PfE; we just need silver or magic weapons and buckets full of holy water. For the second, we need everyone to have PfE and to be able to move past the sniffers. But if the sniffers block our path, we're back to the attack plan.
Let's see if we can get a better picture of what's down there, then plan. Speaking of which:
Zhym wrote:Pendleton surveys the loot. 90 gp worth of coin or items easily convertible to coin, a periapt that's theoretically worth 600 gp but will bring only 150 in quick coin, the big demon mask that's worth either 350 gp or 70 gp, and a magic pitcher. Total value: somewhere between 310 gp and who the hell knows? 4,000 gp, more or less?
"I have no idea how to divide this evenly," he admits. "Gentlemen, I have a radical suggestion: let us not try. I believe our next task is set for us: we have to close the hell mouth. Instead of divvying what meager and/or cumbersome spoils we have accumulated, I propose that we use what funds and services we can purchase with these items to prepare for our return to finish what we started. I would suggest, as a start, that we load up on as much holy water as we can carry."
How much do NPCs need as their share of the loot? 1/7 of cash-out value? How do we even estimate cash-out value with a magic item in the mix?
If we assume 4,000 total value, that's about 570 each. But that's with one item worth 3,000 gp (the pitcher), another worth 600, another worth 350, and some pocket change. That's a partition problem with no answer—there's no way to divide that into even shares. Or we could assume 310+N, which split three ways is 44+N/7, but we can only split it with items worth 350, 600, N, and 90 of divisible change. Which, again: not really possible without giving someone a windfall. And as for getting full value on items at some point in the future, I'm happy to give the departing party members shares of future profits, if they'll take that as payment, but it seems unlikely.
The problem goes away if we can all agree that this is a quick resupply stop into town that doesn't trigger treasure distribution or NPC departure. But I get that players gone NPC have to split off once we reach town.
So who do we need to cash out, and what will they accept?
Since party composition is changing, I recommend dividing up now. You have six PCs and an NPC. If you can't divide the value you can draw lots (good for magic items) or donate it to the church and I will divide the XP evenly.
One of the problems here is that the departing PCs/NPCs are gumming up the works without contributing anything to the loot distribution discussion. Everyone in the party could agree to punt loot distribution until the demon hole problem is actually fixed, but we can't because the mandatory departures force us to do a loot split with difficult-to-split loot. And it seems a shame to throw away money that could be doing something useful just so NPCs can get 45 gp each (if we just sell everything but the pitcher). And if we wanted to give NPC'd players their parting gifts and use the items to prep for the next delve, we'd have to take up a collection to pay off the departing PCs!
But all that aside, we don't even know what the NPCs want.
Okay, okay. Assuming we can't punt loot distribution and treat this as a pit stop, here are some possible loot splits, all crappy:
(1) We draw lots for the periapt, mask, and pitcher and split the 90 gp among the four who don't win the lottery (22.5 gp each). Procedurally fair, but not equitable. Better than even chance any given departing NPC gets 22.5 gp. About an 89% chance that at least one of the really valuable items goes to an NPC. (Grimble and Idriss are effectively NPCs at the moment, right?)
(2) We sell everything but the pitcher. We draw lots for the pitcher, everyone else gets ~51.6 gp. Fair and mostly equitable, but we throw 730 gp away.
(2a) Sell everything but the pitcher, donate the pitcher. Everyone gets 44.2 gp and some XP (but see below about donating). Fair and equitable, but we still throw 730 gp away and we take a potentially useful magic item out of the game.
(3) Donate the periapt, mask, and pitcher, or use them for group promotions/tributes and split 90 gp seven ways. Everyone gets about 12.8 gp each and some XP. If it's one XP per gp, that's 135 XP each, not including whatever the pitcher is worth if we donate it. But wouldn't we have to donate it to the Chapel of Baudh? Wouldn't that donation be awkward from Templars of Eruanna? And we take the pitcher out of the game.
(4) We "buy out" Idriss, Dolph, and Grimble (unless sirravd gets a chance to drop in and say he wants to go with us on the return trip), use what's left to scry and supply (do we need more silver weapons?), and delay further loot distribution until our job is done. The big problem is figuring out what an NPC share is worth.
If it were up to me, I'd figure out what the buy-out price is and probably go with (4).
As long as folks give back their remaining holy water and empty flasks, Able can make more holy water for free. And use his own 2pp to buy more half kegs for more holy water.
Regarding loot, if those are the only codes, Able is most okay with 2a or 3, choosing the Infirmary as the place of donation. But how about something different? Let's risk sending the objects d'art South. There is a 10% chance of losing each, but let's look at it this way:
Demon Mask: 70gp now (or possibly lost) vs a chance at 245-385gp later.
Copper Periapt: 40gp now (or possibly lost) vs a chance at 140-220gp later.
Elvish Brass Broach: 20gp now vs (I believe) vs 70-110gp later.
Then just sell/split everything else: 70gp worth of silver coins, plates, etc, and 50gp worth of glow organs. 120gp ÷ 7 = 17gp each for now.
That leaves us with a golden pitcher, covered in a wave-like pattern of etched lines. It is of marvelous workmanship. (Magic Item - 4001xp.) Able is fine donating it to the Infirmary, hoping they can repurpose it to help the ailing. We'd each get some XP out of the deal, too.
Also, does anyone have a good CHA and want to try telling our tale? Or, considering the mess we created, should we each pony up and pay the bard? So the townsfolk don't run us out of Gaul? Able has a CHA 12 and is happy to pitch in 30gp (his share and another 13gp) to the cause.
How do we pay off shares now with money we won't get until later?
And maybe I've played too many Infocom games, but I can't help thinking that pitcher might be useful before we're done with the demon hole. Or that we at least shouldn't get rid of it until we know otherwise.
Here's a wacky thought. We can use the periapt and the mask to buy things at full face value, right? At a combined value of 950, we could use them to get 19 potions of healing, which would be a lot more divisible than a big damn mask or a periapt.
Another thought: how much cash are people sitting on? We could calculate shares based on 1040 gp total value, but people who want the mask or the periapt need to pay cash to make up the difference between the value of those items and their share. So if a total share is 148.5 and Pendleton wants the 600gp periapt as part of his share, he can pay 451.5 gp to take it.
Here is yet another possible split based on people being able to pay in (and assuming we can convert silver to gold easily enough):
1) Periapt (600 gp), pay in 459 gp = 141 gp
2) Mask (350 gp), pay in 200 gp = 150 gp
3) 5 fire beetle organs (@10 gp), 100 gp = 150 gp
4) Brooch (20 gp), 131 gp = 149 gp
5) 150 gp
6) 150 gp
7) 150 gp
Total: 1040 gp.
Shares with easily portable gem-like items are slightly lower to account for the usefulness of being able to wear 600gp around your neck.
That leaves the pitcher out of it, but we can either draw lots for that or wait to distribute it until we finish the mission, with a promise to the members of the current party that they'll be included in however it's eventually distributed.
