OOC Chat V

[Norjax]

^ Good luck!

[Zhym]

Last time Kurot leveled, as I recall, the risks of an “upgrade” roll for speed were bigger than the possible benefits. Am I remembering that about right?

[Norjax]

Last time Kurot leveled, as I recall, the risks of an “upgrade” roll for speed were bigger than the possible benefits. Am I remembering that about right?

Kurot is at the maximum level for Increased Speed.

He could try and improve his Duralloy Chassis (Carapace). A roll of 11 & below will risk a reduction or defect. Remember, Luck may be used before or after a roll. I don't think this has been allowed, but androids may Glowburn to improve a roll. The amount of points for a Glowburn must be declared before the roll.

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I could play a second player if that helps.

I'll leave the recruitment post up for a week. If no one responds, you may take a second character.

[Zhym]

Improving Kurot’s carapace will slow him down though, right?

[Norjax]

Improving Kurot’s carapace will slow him down though, right?

Most likely, but he does have some to spare!

[Zhym]

Improving Kurot’s carapace will slow him down though, right?

Most likely, but he does have some to spare!

Good point. What’s his current count of luck points? And is the mutation roll when leveling basically a re-roll, or does it build on his current mutation? If the roll were 11-12, that would mean no change? Just wondering how many luck points he’d need to have ready to avoid ending up worse off (bearing in mind that a 1 is always a possibility).

[Norjax]

Good point. What’s his current count of luck points?

8

And is the mutation roll when leveling basically a re-roll, or does it build on his current mutation?

It is a re-roll.

If the roll were 11-12, that would mean no change?

2-11 would result in a loss of AC bonus. 12-13 would mean no change.

Just wondering how many luck points he’d need to have ready to avoid ending up worse off (bearing in mind that a 1 is always a possibility).

In addition to Luck, Kurot may also Glowburn by sacrificing points of Strength, Agility and/or Stamina to gain a roll bonus. Each point takes one day to “heal” (automatic repair).

[Zhym]

Thanks!

I'll give it a shot, then. I can't get into the roller right now, though (I can't remember what e-mail I used when I signed up). Feel free to roll for me, or I'll roll once I have access again. If you want to roll for me, please use +9 from glowburn (4 from STR, 5 from STA), since androids recover that faster than luck (and maybe we could spend some of the time recovering that in town).

[greyarea]

If I do a significant enough glowborn, can we stay in Hagleton long enough for Denslow to recover? I'm considering 20 points, which would be a three-week recovery...

[Zhym]

I'm fine staying that long, but I'd want to add a few more globurn to my roll if so (I don't want to add too many, though, because I don't think I want to hit the top end of the carapace chart).

[Norjax]

Thanks!

I'll give it a shot, then. I can't get into the roller right now, though (I can't remember what e-mail I used when I signed up). Feel free to roll for me, or I'll roll once I have access again. If you want to roll for me, please use +9 from glowburn (4 from STR, 5 from STA), since androids recover that faster than luck (and maybe we could spend some of the time recovering that in town).

We have time to wait for the resolution of your access issue.

If I do a significant enough glowborn, can we stay in Hagleton long enough for Denslow to recover? I'm considering 20 points, which would be a three-week recovery...

If you travel with the large group heading into Motter's area, they are not going to wait 3 weeks. The trip however will take about that long and being in a large group should avoid any random encounters along the way.

Glowburning 20 points isn't addressed in the rules, but I have to think there should be SOME detriment burning that many points at once. After all, it is technically ingesting (overloading internal power for androids) a radioactive substance. The rules do state that Glowburning any ability below 3 requires bed rest and inactivity until it heals back above 3.

Currently the only detriment to massive Glowburn is rest and the associated lodging expenses. I'd like to allow such a sacrifice but think there should be some cost besides time and coin to balance the significant gain. Is the risk of rolling a '1' enough? I'm thinking a type of minor defect, possibly temporary, that reminds the players of the ultimate cost for Glowburning. Always goes last for initiative? Always fails the first Fortitude save of an attack? Double ration requirements?

Thoughts?

[Zhym]

Here we go:

Duralloy Chassis upgrade, +11 Glowburn (5 STR, 6 STA): [1d20+11]=3+11=14

Good thing I used all those Glowburn points!

[greyarea]

Glowburning (and Spellburning, from which it derives) should always have a great cost. This is interesting because most Spellburning is done at a time of great stress (fighting off a demon or dragon) rather than leisure as this would be. The only time I've judged it when done during a leisure time was with Patron Bond (which already takes a week to cast and requires quests as well). Glowburn isn't exactly the same but similar enough...

The rules as written state "...causing the mutant great pain and sickness as a side effect – but also briefly amplifying the effects of one mutation." The use of the term "briefly" suggests that perhaps it shouldn't apply to passive mutations and leveling at all. Maybe only Luck should apply to these rolls.

Any of the minor defects you suggest makes sense to me. Other possibilities: Per or Int lowered (raising at 1 point per week or something) due to additional strain to system, negative saves (Fort and also Will and Reflex) for the next xx saves, active mutations not available for next xx rounds of combat...

Or you could rule that a max of burn is allowed, either because there is only so much mildly radioactive substance around or because so much radiation is almost assuredly deadly to any organism. I could see a limit of 9 points as a max (either from one stat or a combination of stats) when glow burning, especially in non-combat situations.

[Norjax]

Good thing I used all those Glowburn points!

Yep. Probably why it was written into the rules.

Glowburning (and Spellburning, from which it derives) should always have a great cost.

You are correct that there isn’t an equivalent Burn in DCC to improve a permanent attribute upon level gain. The Glowburn during combat works close enough to Spellburn in DCC that there isn’t a balance issue. Did the Devs overlook the potential abuse for Glowburn during level progression? It does state that Luck or Glowburn may be used to improve a Passive Mutation upon level gain.

A case scenario; If at the end of a Face-to-Face session a character levels, the player will think “Hell, I’ll go for broke and Glowburn my physical stats down to three and my character will just rest until the next session. My character can afford it.” This isn’t the same as a cleric resting for several days to renew healing spells and restore a wounded comrade back to health. This is a gain that, for a 1 in 20 risk, will improve gameplay.

[greyarea]

From the issues MCC had when launching, I would guess that it wasn’t playtested. Or they decided “it’s a swingy system anyway, let the judge decide.”

[Zhym]

I find it interesting that the mutation rolls don't get any better as you level. You can use luck and Glowburn, but a 10th level mutation roll is the same as a 1st-level mutation roll and can improve or degrade a passive ability with the same odds at either level. To someone who is used to leveling meaning improvement, that's weird. So I guess I don't see being able to "game" the mutation rolls when leveling as a big problem considering the lack of any bonus to the roll based on level.

[Norjax]

From the issues MCC had when launching, I would guess that it wasn’t playtested. Or they decided “it’s a swingy system anyway, let the judge decide.”

I'm curious to the history of the as-written rule for Active Mutation failure for the day. At low levels, you could get into a situation where a beneficial mutation fails and is not available until the next day; sort of the equivalent to a D&D 1st level spell caster. I came from Mutant Future (based on Gamma World) where "active" mutations are available at-will, multiple times per day. I added the "Fails, try again" range to help mimic Mutant Future's game play.

I find it interesting that the mutation rolls don't get any better as you level. You can use luck and Glowburn, but a 10th level mutation roll is the same as a 1st-level mutation roll...

The mutation rolls improve by 1 point each level. Kurot's active powers are now a base 1d20+4.

[Zhym]

I find it interesting that the mutation rolls don't get any better as you level. You can use luck and Glowburn, but a 10th level mutation roll is the same as a 1st-level mutation roll...

The mutation rolls improve by 1 point each level. Kurot's active powers are now a base 1d20+4.

Sorry—maybe I'm not using the right terminology. I meant the roll I get to make when Kurot levels to see if his passive mutation changes. I'm surprised that the roll is just for a change, not an improvement (as it would be if the +4 also applied to that roll). It's not a complaint, just a, "Huh, that's weird" from someone who isn't familiar with the system. Obviously, there are advantages to leveling. It just seems like an increased chance of improving a passive mutation isn't one of them.

[Norjax]

Sorry—maybe I'm not using the right terminology. I meant the roll I get to make when Kurot levels to see if his passive mutation changes. I'm surprised that the roll is just for a change, not an improvement (as it would be if the +4 also applied to that roll). It's not a complaint, just a, "Huh, that's weird" from someone who isn't familiar with the system. Obviously, there are advantages to leveling. It just seems like an increased chance of improving a passive mutation isn't one of them.

Perhaps I wasn't clear on this. Kurot's 4th Level base Mutation Check Roll is 1d20+4. He uses this for the Passive re-roll. So, using your roll of a 3, the correct result is an 18! (3+4+11)

I assume that since the Passive Mutation is always available, it was deemed not to automatically improve at each level gain. With the small risk of a defect and a moderate risk of losing the mutation's benefits for that level, the rules allow one to 'jump' their character ahead with a vast improvement so long as the die roll is favorable.

A potential great leap is exciting and makes the game interesting. I just think there should be more of a price for an excessive Glowburn than time and money.

[Zhym]

Perhaps I wasn't clear on this. Kurot's 4th Level base Mutation Check Roll is 1d20+4. He uses this for the Passive re-roll. So, using your roll of a 3, the correct result is an 18! (3+4+11)

Ah! I'd missed that part. That makes sense.

I assume that since the Passive Mutation is always available, it was deemed not to automatically improve at each level gain. With the small risk of a defect and a moderate risk of losing the mutation's benefits for that level, the rules allow one to 'jump' their character ahead with a vast improvement so long as the die roll is favorable.

A potential great leap is exciting and makes the game interesting. I just think there should be more of a price for an excessive Glowburn than time and money.

Quite true. So what counts as "excessive?" Maybe it could be something where there are tiers of effects? For example, one level of consequences if you bring any of your attributes to a -1 modifier, another if you use up to half your attribute points, and one that are stronger still if you draw down to 3 on any stat? Just throwing ideas out there. I'd suggest that any price be calibrated to handle both downtime situations like this one and "Oh crap, I need a boost at any cost" situations, where the use of massive Glowburn could be really cool.