Re: Character Generation

[Enoch]

I would argue that maybe the answer to the second question is yes, but only for that "leader" boar, simply because full budo for all of them boosts a starting character halfway to 2nd level with a single roll, and I don't think a 6-level system is meant to work that way.

[jmacatty]

I've never learned the Shugendo rules, since I always played a character which earned Budo. But I would say that the Shugenja should receive the Shugendo for successfully casting a spell. He didn't overcome the boars so much as avoid them. If Shugendo is that readily available, the magic users will soon be way overpowered. Also, I would point out that Budo/Shugendo should be fairly difficult to gain, which I've always thought was the reason for the way the rules were written. Only receiving Budo for the killing blow is not what it seems, since in combat the warriors tend to pair off with foes, rather than ganging up, which would reflect the style of combat in ancient Japan.

[ffilz]

Lots of good conversation.

So my thought is that "overcome foe by magic" definitely applies. Since there was no "fight" at all, my opinion is no budo for the Bushi. Conversely, if the Bushi defeat a foe in combat without any magic, then the Shugenja and Gakusho don't get any Shugendo, They have to use magic with that award, or overcome foe with magic with a potentially higher award.

And yea, looks like no On in this case at all and no loss of On since the challenge was avoided. If the boars had actually charged and Bushi ran away... But the boars were stopped before they made an overt challenge.

That does raise a question. If you encounter Bushi, and there's sword rattling but no challenge issued, does the side that walks away lose On?

[jmacatty]

Without a doubt.

[Marullus]

A hex is a day's travel. Travel is 1.5x on roads. (using standard OSR logic) It will be .5x in rough mountains.

Unless there's feelings otherwise, I'll use standard OSR travel on the hex-map... I am focusing on story, and I haven't seen the overland travel rules in the Bushido books. If anyone else doesn't mind looking through and finding them, we can discuss them here and implement them.

[jemmus]

Strategic Travel is based on the character's BMA, with terrain modifiers. A character can travel 1 hex per 3 points of BMA per day, round up.

Terrain and road conditions modify this rate of movement as
follows:
Travelling on major road: +100% to effective BMA
On minor road: +50% to effective BMA
In Clear Terrain (0-1000‘ above sea level): No effect on BMA
In Rough Terrain (1000-2000’ above sea level): -25% to effective BMA
In Mountainous Terrain (over 2000 above sea level): -50% to effective BMA
Heavy snow on ground: -25% to effective BMA

Using my PC Toshizo as an example. He has BMA 7. If we're traveling on a minor road, he gets a 50% bonus to BMA. But if we're in mountainous terrain, that's -50%, so back to BMA 7. 7 / 3 = 2.3, round up to 3. Toshizo can travel 3 hexes per day on a minor road in the mountains.

I think the map makes Nippon look bigger than it really is. An entire Nippon province is rally about the size of a U.S. county. It looks like Toshizo go from one end of Shinano to the other in maybe three days, using the Nakasendo. (Too bad the hexes map doesn't have province borders).

[Marullus]

Aha! Thanks! I think I can make sense of that.

Also, the group is therefore governed by its slowest BMA.

(Too bad the hexes map doesn't have province borders).

It does - they're the dark, solid borders and the province names are the large gray words. You can see Hida is pretty small and all the provinces thst surround it (Shinano appears southeast-ish).

[jemmus]

Hmm. I'm looking at this map. Is there a different hexes map? Edit: Now I see that you have a more detailed map from the module. I suppose the scale is the same (3/ri (8 miles)) per hex.

[Marullus]

Oh, I see. I am referring to this one which is zoomed in for this campaign.

[ffilz]

Oh, I see. I am referring to this one which is zoomed in for this campaign.

The two maps have the same size hexes.

I was REALLY hoping the Land of the Rising Sun Kickstarter was going to result in a good usable map. Sadly that was not the case...

Honestly, except for the level of detail and it being a bit hard to read, the Bushido GM Screen map is the best RPG map for Japan of everything that I've seen, though trying to match it up with a real map was troublesome (when I was looking for more detail).

[jemmus]

Yeah, it's an amazing hex map, with terrain symbol coded down to the hex. The Bushido developers did not fool around. WTH was going on at FGU back in the day?

[Marullus]

We will apply 1062.4 USING STATUS to this encounter.

Status can be used to seek admission to a group, or to gain advancement in it. It may be used to request a favor from some character in a position to grant one.

Please decide if you are introducing yourselves individually or collectively.
Please decide what you (individually or collectively) are requesting. Group membership? Paid duties? Identification of others here? etc.
Please decide if you are introducing yourself by clan or by profession and provide the appropriate factor.
Please decide if you are attempting to modify the interaction with "spontaneous use of Social Arts" or gifts.
(If you have a skill that allows the manufacture of something, I will allow you to roll it to have prepared and brought a gift from your art. Otherwise it is a matter of purchase. I will allow retroactive purchase if you have the coin, since we're just starting.)
Roll 1d20 (for each individual/group introduced) and I'll determine the Effect score(s).

** Note, the status example on page 25 is full of typos, most particularly using 7s instead of 1s. It makes sense if you read "75" as "15" for example when talking about BCS, which could never be in the 70s.

Proactively starting off this conversation here. I am excited to kick the tires on the status/social mechanics of Bushido. I think I've got my mind wrapped all the way around it, but I'm sure we'll find some interesting things when we start putting it to the test.

[jemmus]

Please decide if you are introducing yourselves individually or collectively.
I think Toshizo has to introduce himself individually. He's been designated as the spokesman, but he doesn't have the confidence for that. And he doesn't want to speak for Taka and possibly get her in trouble.

Please decide what you (individually or collectively) are requesting. Group membership? Paid duties? Identification of others here? etc.
Toshizo will hint that he's looking for employment as a bushi.

Please decide if you are introducing yourself by clan or by profession and provide the appropriate factor.
Since Toshizo's on the road and his clan is in Shinano, he'll introduce himself by profession (bushi, .6)

Please decide if you are attempting to modify the interaction with "spontaneous use of Social Arts" or gifts.
(If you have a skill that allows the manufacture of something, I will allow you to roll it to have prepared and brought a gift from your art. Otherwise it is a matter of purchase. I will allow retroactive purchase if you have the coin, since we're just starting.)
Toshizo has very little coin and little Wit.

Roll 1d20 (for each individual/group introduced) and I'll determine the Effect score(s).
Toshizo: [1d20]=14

[Marullus]

All rules for social rolling crunched and the IC interpretations provided.
viewtopic.php?p=550049#p550049

I'll admit that I'm pretty happy with it. I was able to calculate each of you individually. A clear success would have gotten you into camp (and able to find out what the camp is, and opportunities to learn who leads it). A partial success (where you are) has you render a service before entering camp. All failures would have had you rebuffed (instead of just some of you). You each have an initial reaction that you can roleplay off if and improve from.

Clearly, using social arts is a significant boon to social interactions (if you pass your BCS... otherwise the gaffs are worse!). You are all relying on personal status (a fair move until you rise in a clan) which will go up modestly with level. I think that having Clan Status WITH the clan you're engaging is going to be the clear better option to strive for. It's a goal.

What are your thoughts?

[jemmus]

That was some work on GM's part! Thanks for the breakdown of everything, that will help when this comes up in the other game. I think the system works better than I'd guessed it would. It gave results that were reasonable and made sense. What I don't know is how to work in PC's clan's factor instead of his profession's factor. I suppose the clan's factor could apply if the PC were close to home, where people might know of his clan and its relative status.

I don't understand why the rules treat all of the castes the same when assigning rank (Low=10, Middle=20, High=30). So a high rank eta and high rank samurai are both 30.

I'd agree that gaining status with this clan is the best option.

[Marullus]

There is a reference that you use the clan if on "Clan business." Bushi are pretty well respected (.6 factor) so not too much of an issue. It will be an immediate factor for Taka, however, when she says she is here representing the Satake clan to resolve the murder of her brother. She is a Senior Member (20) or in this matter even Supervisor (40) with Favor of the Clan Head (+10) and a clan status factor of .7 so 50x.7 = 35 or BCS 7, which is much better than her personal status of 8 (BCS 1) as an independent Shugenja.

If the parties have status in the same clan, then you don't multiply by the factor. So, that's potentially a big help for the non-Bushi too.

I think good social arts are the real winner, though. Eiji doing well on Buddhist Theology added straight to the Effect. If Taka had done the same, adding the effect of a BCS 18 Rhetoric roll, she likely could've talked her way into the camp easily by sheer doubletalk and force of will.

(I also am now REALLY looking forward to Ha's backlash and triumphant return when he overcomes the stigma of this initial roll and assets his honor. Build up to trying out the Duel mechanics, even. )

[Enoch]

I don't understand why the rules treat all of the castes the same when assigning rank (Low=10, Middle=20, High=30). So a high rank eta and high rank samurai are both 30.

This surprised me too. In the other game my ninja is Eta, but has higher status than most PCs. In my headcanon I'm assume that my clan is feared by everyone who knows them and Katsumi is therefore treated with respect even if they privately find his methods dishonorable.

[Marullus]

On is universal and initial On takes caste and rank into account.

My take on it is that this Status is within caste. A High Eta knows how to be superior to Low Eta just as much as a High Buke knows how to be superior to Low Buke.

When status crosses caste or group, then the Factor is multiplied.
A High Heimin Merchant? .1
Unaffiliated Ninja or Yakuza? .1 or .2
Lowest Samurai family or any Bushi/Ronin? .6
...that all evens out.

Enoch makes an interesting point on Ninja - individual Ninja are .2 but a Ninja Clan can be up to .8. It is only as a clan that Ninja are to be reckoned with.

[jemmus]

I missed that the Birth Table in character creation assigns a base initial On. Makes sense now. A high rank ronin starts with much more On than, say, a high rank heimin merchant (30 vs. 3).

[Marullus]

Copying this in because it is from the Errata file and not the core book:

Group Status is one's status inside the group, or as a representative of a group (a Clan, a gang, what
ever). It is not personal, it is one's station in the group. It is really only used in the group for Status uses
and supersedes Person Status in those situations. A member of the Koga Clan on Koga Business uses
Koga Status, but on Personal Business uses Personal Status. This is because the use of Group Status
brings the Group's reputation into the actions of the character. If the character is not on Koga Business
and claims to be and in some way insults someone they bring shame to the Koga Clan.

Personal Status is modified by Profession, Group Status is not modified inside the Group but is modified
by Group Factor when used outside the group. If the above character had a Personal Status of 60 and a
Group Status of 60 as a Bushi they would have an effective Status of (60 x 0.6 =) 36 on Personal
Business, and a (if the Koga clan were Status .9) (60 x .9 =) 54 Status on Clan Business, and a 60 inside
the Clan for any business.

So, Personal Status is important personally and Group is important in relation to the Group (both in the
group and when representing the group). When there is a question of which Status to use ask if this is a
Group issue or a Personal Issue.

Also, a character may be a member of several groups: Clan, Ryu, Organization, Secret Conspiracy, etc...