Pre-Game Discussion. Laying the Foundations.

[Q.Q Elf]

Hello, all.

I would like to have our Pre-Game discussion here, without polluting the OOC thread with potential Boundary-crossing issues that might cause discomfort.

What is this thread about?

We will be setting up your characters, your characters' high school, a common classroom your characters inhabit within the school setting, the larger game world, and the inklings of villains and menace that exist within the world.

We will also talk about personal Boundaries. How far are you willing to go? What topics are forbidden for you and your character? What content causes a personal problem for you, and how can we respect your feelings?

I would prefer a minimum of personal details. I believe in the shield of privacy here, and how it should be respected.

However, I may ask questions that you may or may not wish to answer because they may be too personal. That's okay if there is no answer. I respect that Boundary, and I do not mean to make anyone uncomfortable.

[Q.Q Elf]

Our teenage angsty monsters so far...

• Rukellian - undecided
• MonkeyWrench - The Werewolf
• Metal Fatigue - The Hollow

(If I make jokes, it is because of the essential unease of this whole thing. It's because I respect it, and the process, that I feel uneasy.)

I have made our classroom seating chart HERE.

It's in Google Docs. I haven't set it to be open to editing YET.

If you wish for anonymity (because I can see who accesses these docs), then please use or set up an anonymized Gmail account to access the Google Docs that I will use for this game. I certainly welcome the anonymity myself.

I have also set up a Skin/character sheet template HERE.

I will also set up the initial sheets for your own characters, and then open them up for editing. This is our Werewolf, as an example.

...

Lastly, I'm new to this game. I just felt the need to run it. Maybe that makes me strange, but you're here, aren't you?!

[Metal Fatigue]

I'm not new to this game. Like, really not new. It's one of my top two games right now (the other being Chuubo's Marvelous Wish-Granting Engine).

I've played the Hollow once, briefly, at a convention, and had a great time. We'll see whether it holds up for a longer game.

I'm new here, and I will be very interested to see how this game works on a board with such a restrictive social contract when it comes to sexual references. I swear I will do my utmost not to get the rest of you banned.

[Rukellian]

Lastly, I'm new to this game. I just felt the need to run it. Maybe that makes me strange, but you're here, aren't you?!

This, lol.

I'm going to be spending the next hour or so trying to figure out what skin I want... but there is a problem with that. Most monsters don't get to choose who they are or how they came to be. Usually its something they are forced to live with, deal with. (Example: I didn't choose to die that night and become a ghost or ghoul. I wanted to live a normal life like everyone else. Being a zombie or a ghost was not my first choice and I don't think it ever would have been, but fate has sealed my life in an unnatural way... so I have to make the most of it I suppose. Another example: I've never been invited to a party before, so this was definitely a first for me. I heard alcohol would be involved but I know I am smart enough to stay away from such things. When the party was in full swing, people started to vanish. I grew nervous and didn't want to get caught up in whatever was going on. I shouldn't have even been here, way past my curfew! I woke a few hours later that night and found myself strapped to some sort of torture rack. Oh god! What has happened, why did I come here? What are they going to do to me!? *insert evil ritual here*)

So if you feel that this sort of start is more appropriate, in that I don't get a say in what kind of monster or predicament I'm thrown into, have become, then I say go for it! The less control I have as a character in this game, the better I think.

Some personal notes about my own boundaries. In real life, I do not smoke, drink or take drugs. I am not a party animal and I never really did fit in with my high school peers. Still a virgin, so yeah.... this will be fun. I think I will be fine with just about anything, but I am not too keen on the idea of potentially killing young children. That will be a personal taboo in my book. I may end up trying to save them if that is the case.

[Q.Q Elf]

Yes, the SFW limit is a hard one. I considered not doing this here because of the limit.

If we have to cross the line because the story and the drama demands it, then we'll move elsewhere.

If anything, it provides an extra layer of Safety and a simple Boundary to backstop what we do... but if we all feel comfortable in our Skins, then I am open to moving.


...

Okay... the Hollow sheet is HERE.

It's not editable yet, but it's showing where we're going, anyway.

I'll probably open up the sheets to editing tomorrow once I feel satisfied with the overall layout.

...

HOMEWORK for you!

I would like character art for your characters. I don't want a photograph, though. Why? Because photographs are taken from real actual people, and I want to maintain the separation.

I am reminded of something I read about what Goro Miyazaki said about "From Up on Poppy Hill". He didn't set out to recreate the world of post-WW2 Japan. His images were a depiction of how a younger person's memory would recall the places and people depicted in the film... the colors, the quality of the light, and so on.

This is how I'd like you to approach finding your character's image, and how you might approach roleplaying this game.

[Rukellian]

So some ideas have been floating in my head about my character. What if he started off as human, but then became a ghost? I would play as a mortal for the beginning of the game, but then something freak or tragic will happen and then I will be a ghost. How does that sound?

----

Will probably be a ghost (male), to make things a little more simple on everyone. Working an in-story transition from mortal to ghost will take lots of work, not to mention the changing of character template information.

[Q.Q Elf]

Lastly, I'm new to this game. I just felt the need to run it. Maybe that makes me strange, but you're here, aren't you?!

This, lol.

I'm going to be spending the next hour or so trying to figure out what skin I want... but there is a problem with that. Most monsters don't get to choose who they are or how they came to be. Usually its something they are forced to live with, deal with.

Pick the monster skin that speaks to you. Metal Fatigue reminds me that there are also other Skins available on the internet, although I am most partial to the ones written by the author (which includes The Hollow).

You can find additional character skins HERE.

It's not so much the being as it is the story of becoming. Don't worry about plausible identity. Think about the story that the monster is trying to say, and how it speaks to the person the monster would like to become. What's the darkness in you?

If anything, the Darkest Self might be the most "fun" part to analyze for who you'd like to inhabit for a while. At least that's how I read it on a superficial level. If the skin's Darkness echoes your own Darkness, there's an extra level of truth to it, I think.

Some personal notes about my own boundaries. In real life, I do not smoke, drink or take drugs. I am not a party animal and I never really did fit in with my high school peers. Still a virgin, so yeah.... this will be fun. I think I will be fine with just about anything, but I am not too keen on the idea of potentially killing young children. That will be a personal taboo in my book. I may end up trying to save them if that is the case.

I think we will avoid killing children. People who harm children? Maybe they will have a place in the game... to drive your character forward.

For me, I was a virgin for a while. Not in a rush. Then I met my wife, and it all went downhill from there.

You never realize how attractive and whole you are until you've found yourself in a loving relationship, and then you can't go around picking up all the strangers you want to go off with anymore. It's sad, in its way.

EDIT:
Also, for a while, I only drank to excess. It was bad. I even went to AA once. It was worth it just to talk, but I didn't need it. I can limit my drinks now, but it wasn't always that way. I know the capacity for excess exists in me, but I'm not that person anymore.

[Q.Q Elf]

I'm not new to this game. Like, really not new. It's one of my top two games right now (the other being Chuubo's Marvelous Wish-Granting Engine).

I've played the Hollow once, briefly, at a convention, and had a great time. We'll see whether it holds up for a longer game.

I'm new here, and I will be very interested to see how this game works on a board with such a restrictive social contract when it comes to sexual references. I swear I will do my utmost not to get the rest of you banned.

oh, and welcome (I forgot all about post approvals & such for new members).

Like I said in the prior post, we'll run SFW for now. I thought the extended play description in the book was good. It didn't flaunt nudity or graphicness, but it was sexy. I compare it to scenes in Buffy the Vampire Slayer, as compared to scenes in True Blood. We can get away with describing something that might go on in Buffy. We cannot get away with scenes from True Blood.

As for knowing the game, I'm always open to advice If I screw up, please let me know.

However, I'm aware of things like Boundaries and keeping us all Safe. Maybe that makes me the right kind of MC, or maybe not. I don't know.

I hope we all have fun!

[Metal Fatigue]

However, I'm aware of things like Boundaries and keeping us all Safe.

I always start any game I run with a detailed discussion of Lines and Veils.

• Lines: where play will not go, period.
• Veils: where play will not go onscreen. Fade-to-black territory.

So I think you're doing it right so far.

As for myself, I've played this game with the Veil set anywhere from PG-13 to NC-17 with equal fun, but the Line on sexual behavior was always drawn pretty loosely.

[Q.Q Elf]

However, I'm aware of things like Boundaries and keeping us all Safe.

I always start any game I run with a detailed discussion of Lines and Veils.

• Lines: where play will not go, period.
• Veils: where play will not go onscreen. Fade-to-black territory.

So I think you're doing it right so far.

As for myself, I've played this game with the Veil set anywhere from PG-13 to NC-17 with equal fun, but the Line on sexual behavior was always drawn pretty loosely.

The sexual behavior part, I'm open to wherever anyone wants to go. I'm comfortable with who I am, and if someone wants to move their character in a way that isn't me, then I will roll with it because it isn't about me.

...

If anyone is uncomfortable with certain things, then speak up. It might not be now (because you might not know it until you hit that point)... but please feel as if you can speak up.

Like gender and sexuality. I know that certain things might be taboo for some people, and if you feel like you can't go to some places, then I am okay with that. Boundaries & respect for each other are so critical.

Now, I will not tolerate intolerant slurs against people's various identities... like race, religion, sexual orientation.

This is from the player standpoint, mind you.

There's a certain leeway within characterization, provided that we do not create scenes that are demonstrably NSFW with offensive language (i.e. certain words for other races, for instance... or completely homophobic terms that have no place in SFW discussion). Some of it can be good... like a character who says she hates certain people, but when she (the character) overcomes that intolerance, then that's a wonderful character moment that would be fun to share.

Setting that line between character & player is very important. Make sure you've got your character locked away in his or her own compartment. I think it will help you all find ways to push things further than you thought you might go.

(in a SFW way, of course )

[Metal Fatigue]

If anyone is uncomfortable with certain things, then speak up.

I'd prefer to draw lines against torture, pre-teen sex and incest. Probably some other things that don't spring to mind.

[Q.Q Elf]

If anyone is uncomfortable with certain things, then speak up.

I'd prefer to draw lines against torture, pre-teen sex and incest. Probably some other things that don't spring to mind.

Those are all certainly off the table.

Teenagers in High School (Junior year is okay?) are already taboo enough, which is another reason for watching the NSFW line, I think. So Pre-teens are definitely out.

The Werewolf might run over some children, though, because Werewolfs have their way of going wrong...

Torture is out. I think. Nothing graphic, nor even close to on-screen, but maybe a bad thing in the background? I.e. the bad guy(s)?

Torture is out, but domestic violence is okay? I mean, not OKAY okay, but as a topic? Something to work against?

Regarding The Hollow, so I read it & see a person who has a miserable sense of self, who is prone to being abused/taken advantage of because he or she is an outsider. I get a sense of depression, even if I don't know it well myself (not anymore).

I don't want to go to Torture, but I would like Bullying & Domestic Violence in my chest of bad things to pull out.

[Rukellian]

HOMEWORK for you!

I would like character art for your characters. I don't want a photograph, though. Why? Because photographs are taken from real actual people, and I want to maintain the separation.

I am reminded of something I read about what Goro Miyazaki said about "From Up on Poppy Hill". He didn't set out to recreate the world of post-WW2 Japan. His images were a depiction of how a younger person's memory would recall the places and people depicted in the film... the colors, the quality of the light, and so on.

This is how I'd like you to approach finding your character's image, and how you might approach roleplaying this game.

I picked two images for my character, one of his ghost form at his desk in class (invisible) and one of what he looked like while in color (alive). Essentially, the second image will be transparent to in-game characters, at least for those who can actually see him in his transparent state.
If the first image does not work for you, considering that it is a photo of a classroom setting, I will find something else for it.

ghost in classroom.JPG (24.45 KiB) Viewed 826 times

ghost portrait.JPG (38.77 KiB) Viewed 826 times

----

On another note, I'd like to reference something that was said in another thread on this site, an important item to consider when doing contemporary settings in general.

... In my experience, running/playing in a fantasy world game is easier than the contemporary setting. (I'd place Futuristic in the same category as Fantasy, though, and hopefully that will be explained shortly). Over the years, I've played in several contemporary games. In college, it was a lot of Vampire: The Masquerade (and the Werewolf: The Apocalypse companion rules) and when I first started doing PbP gaming, I was involved in a game that used ODD rules in a contemporary setting (dwarves were still used, but they were more like the dwarf from Ann Rice's Taltos; elves were replaced with indigenous people from either of the Americas; halflings were not allowed).

In both cases, the setting was a contemporary time (present day) with a regional location (the former being St. Louis, because most of us were from the St. Louis area, and the latter being Chicago because that is where the DM was from). What made the games harder, in both cases, could be summed up in one word: knowledge. Knowledge of existing legal systems and police tactics and security systems and so on tended to bog things down. It was hard to gloss over them to try and make the game run more smoothly, mostly because a lot of it was information we all knew and understood as the norm. So we always ended up over-thinking things. And it always added the extra layer of people to avoid - law enforcement - in addition to whatever protagonists the DM had centered the game around.

In the fantasy setting, ignorance of how it may have actually been (or having a complete disregard for how it may have been historically) allows the DM and players to more easily gloss over sticky points or even ignore them completely.

You knife a guy in a bar in a contemporary setting and you know the police are going to be involved and might even include a manhunt. This adds whole new difficulties (maybe unwanted) to the game. You knife a guy in a fantasy setting and the guards are called and declare it a clean fight and you go on your merry way.

I think Futuristic setting games are more easily handled like Fantasy settings in that we don't really have any common knowledge about how things are, so it's easier to fudge things and make sure you don't get bogged down thinking too much about real life laws and such.

Does that all make sense?

I don't think there is anything wrong with Contemporary setting games. We had a LOT of fun with Vampire/Werewolf and played it for several years in college (along with Rifts and Warhammer (this was the early 90's, so not WH40K)). That is just my take on why Fantasy settings are used more often than Contemporary ones.

He brings up some good points on our knowledge of how things work in our modern world today. Sure, we are dealing with some supernatural and fantastical things that are mixed in, but the setting has not changed. I think it would be worth keeping this in mind when setting up plot hooks or other such things in this questionable game of ours. Because Tonixx already gave you the okay in going with this game, allowing you to post it up and all that, I'm sure we have some leniancy here in that regard, but we are navigating a minefield to say the least.

[Q.Q Elf]

Oh, locations. It's not truly mentioned in the book, is it? I don't think we're quite ready to talk about the Classroom yet.

Anyway, as a diversion (for me), can we talk about the school as a side topic?

Is anyone from SoCal? San Diego? At this point, I'm thinking of a renamed Encinitas, California - a small coastal "city" north of San Diego. (San Diego has Comicon, Coronado Island (Marines & BUD/S), a couple major California universities, etc). Think: streets lined with trees, bungalows, lots of beach (beneath a drop off), a lot of surfing.

However, it doesn't have to be California. For me, the easiest places to describe would be California, Michigan, Washington (state), Washington (DC), Florida, Texas.

I mention San Diego because of the Marines & BUD/S at Coronado, and because UCSD & SDSU are pretty big things. I can name some areas (PB, La Jolla, Gaslamp, etc) even though I'm not from San Diego.

Buffy's Sunnydale is well north of there (supposedly in Santa Barbara county, which is north of Los Angeles). I can easily pick out areas around Santa Barbara (Goleta, IV, etc), but then I don't get Coronado. Well, maybe there's Vandenberg, out in Lompoc... but that's mostly a rocket launch facility.


Okay, let me look at Rukellian's post before I post more...

[Q.Q Elf]

Rukellian... I think the second image is all we'll need. Looks great! I'll add it to your character sheet.
So it's the Ghost, then?

Here's our updated cast of teenage angst!

• Rukellian - The Ghost
• MonkeyWrench - The Werewolf
• Metal Fatigue - The Hollow

No Mortal? No Buffy wanna-be Chosen? Well, alright, then! I'll have to figure out neat ways to make your stories collide.

...

As for modernity being an impediment...

The Apocalypse World engine just runs on different tracks than Vampire the Masquerade, Werewolf the Apocalypse, or Wraith the Oblivion. It sure isn't d20 Modern.

If the Werewolf massacres a bunch of innocent surfers, then I don't care about rolling d100 for police involvement. I actually don't roll anything. What happens next is that I can throw down a "hard move" in certain contexts, and then you have to react again to the messed up world. Maybe the story does put your character in jail, or in a coma, or running through the woods. The key thing is that it's not about my story & it's not about my twists. What it should be about is your drama.

What matters is the story of personal horror, and how your characters have all this drama around them. I keep the police, the town, the people in my head... but my role is to translate that onto you because you all are the stars of this horrible teenager monster show. Everything is translated for you, and not to make a realistic vision of our times.

And maybe I need to start talking about the actual rules of the game (so that I can better figure them out for myself!)... that's probably the next thread...

[Rukellian]

And maybe I need to start talking about the actual rules of the game (so that I can better figure them out for myself!)... that's probably the next thread...

Would be incredibly helpful Thanks in advance!

[Q.Q Elf]

For your infotainment, an earlier interview with Joe McDaldno (author of this hot mess!) about the game...

http://gfbrobot.com/2012/02/09/joe-mcda ... terhearts/

ALSO... a "Which Monsterhearts teenage monster are you?" internet quiz (in case you're still doubting your choices or you want a laugh).

http://www.whichblankareyou.com/q/which ... er-are-you

I got the Queen

[MonkeyWrench]

HOMEWORK for you!

I would like character art for your characters. I don't want a photograph, though. Why? Because photographs are taken from real actual people, and I want to maintain the separation.

I am reminded of something I read about what Goro Miyazaki said about "From Up on Poppy Hill". He didn't set out to recreate the world of post-WW2 Japan. His images were a depiction of how a younger person's memory would recall the places and people depicted in the film... the colors, the quality of the light, and so on.

This is how I'd like you to approach finding your character's image, and how you might approach roleplaying this game.

I found two pictures that I think kind of capture what I am trying to go for during the normal days and nights for my character. During the day him being the loner type, just trying to stay out of peoples business but still protecting his friends and family.

and then during the night and near the full moon to a more severe degree

And then of course there's the transformation...

That's just what I found in my initial search, not sure if there is anything better out there so it may or may not change before the game officially starts.

Also, the werewolf sheet you posted earlier, is that just an example or was that set up for my character to use and edit?

[Rukellian]

So I'm currently working on my character sheet as well, using an excel spreadsheet as a base. I downloaded this from the link you gave us and went to work in filling it out. How specific do you want us to be when filling it out, like should I add little explanations of what each move does? Do I need to flesh out my strings before we begin, have them tied into my backstory? I'm not exactly sure what to prepare right now considering that I know very little about the game's current setting and what's going on in my character's environment.

You also mentioned something about adding my character pic to the sheet, does this mean that you are preparing it for me ahead of time, allowing me to fill it out later? I'm fine with either way, I just like having my information straightened out and ready to go when it comes to posting our sheets.

----

Before I retire for the day and get my sleep in before work, I have an important question to ask about my character. He is a ghost, right? If that is the case, is he able to have access to his senses (taste, touch, smell, ect.)? I understand that ghosts can feel emotions, or so various forms of fiction have told me. I also understand that they can interact with inanimate objects. Does this reinforce the potential of still maintaining his previous human senses?

I know very little about ghosts, outside of the common knowledge that I think every possesses. But from what I do know, it definitely sounds like an awesome skin to play, hence my decision to play it. I just need to know what my character will be capable of in his deathly state, skills/moves aside. Interacting with the in-game world will take on a whole new meaning if I can no longer smell, taste, or feel things.

[Metal Fatigue]

Advice from an experienced player:

The grounding assumptions of Monsterhearts are different from other games you may be used to. "Play to find out" means you don't write a backstory in advance, or not much of one, because if you do, you're playing before the game starts. There isn't much of a setting, either—just a generic town and a generic school—until the MC starts asking the players questions about the setting, and the players fill in the blanks. You can't really start play as one skin and switch to another, because the skins are archetypes, not character classes or background details.

Just go through the skin exactly as written. Don't do Strings without the help of the other players, because PC Strings are more interesting than NPC Strings. That doesn't mean all your Strings have to be on/from PCs, but many of them should be.