OOC I

[dmw71]

If we want to roll up new PCs, should we go ahead and get started or do you want us to wait?

Go for it.

The sooner we can get a full-sized party assembled, the sooner we can get started.


That said, I should add that if a grandfathered character is passed on in favor of a new character, the grandfathered characters will be considered retired. I'd like to avoid, a week (or month, or year) later springing an "old" character into the game.

[Zhym]

I suspect we won't need them with the 1d6+1d8+4 method, but are 2-for-1 swaps in play?

[dmw71]

I suspect we won't need them with the 1d6+1d8+4 method, but are 2-for-1 swaps in play?

Yes, by the book.

I'm in my car at a red light, but it's detailed on the 'Choosing a Class' (or something like that), probably within the first 10 pages or so.

[Zhym]

Are we using LL or B/X? The 2-for-1 swap is in B/X but I don't think it made it into LL.

Sorry about the confusion—I thought we were using B/X when I asked the question, but I see "LL" everywhere in the forum now that I actually look.

[dmw71]

Are we using LL or B/X?

LL (not AEC).

The 2-for-1 swap is in B/X but I don't think it made it into LL.

It did, but it's kind of hidden.

"Sometimes, a player will
choose a certain class and the character does not have a
prime requisite high enough to receive the experience bonus.
In these cases, 2 ability points may be sacrificed from one
ability to raise one prime requisite ability 1 point. This may be
done more than once, but no ability can be lowered below 9.
There are certain restrictions on how to raise or lower abilities.
No ability may be lowered if it is also a prime requisite for the
class, even if there are a few points to spare above the
minimum required score. Dexterity can only be raised, never
lowered. Constitution and Charisma are the only abilities that
may not be modified in any way."

[dmw71]

While it's by-the-book and not a house rule, per se, I did go ahead and add the details here: Ability Scores.

[Zhym]

Unfortunately, that's less clearly written than the B/X version.

Is 2-for-1 available only if a prime requisite is below a number needed for an experience bonus? If so, can a person only raise the prime stat to the point that gets a bonus?

[dmw71]

Is 2-for-1 available only if a prime requisite is below a number needed for an experience bonus? If so, can a person only raise the prime stat to the point that gets a bonus?

Hmmm... I never caught that. Thankfully, only a 13 is needed for the experience point bonus, so it shouldn't make too big a difference.

[Zhym]

So if I have a thief with a 17 dexterity, can I lower his intelligence by 2 to bump it to 18?

[dmw71]

So if I have a thief with a 17 dexterity, can I lower his intelligence by 2 to bump it to 18?

Well, in that case, the increase isn't going towards an experience point bonus, so no.

By the book, the highest you can increase a stat would be 16.

[Zhym]

Okay. B/X 's rule seems a lot more straightforward, though.

[onlyme]

Uhhh.... I just happened to scroll my browser to the bottom and saw there were new posts in the archived section. Glad I looked. It is possible your other players have not noticed these posts as well. A PM might be prudent.

Of course, I'm in for any game you DM...

You're in. Will you be keeping Junius, or rolling a new character?

As for the game, I sent a PM to Greg last night to have the game unarchived, so hopefully that will happen soon. That should help.

I am leaning toward rerolling. Hopefully by Thursday...

[dmw71]

Okay. B/X 's rule seems a lot more straightforward, though.

Out of curiosity, do you guys (Bluehorse, onlyme, Zhym) own the actual B (of BX, not BECMI) rulebook? I tend to lean on the OGL equivalent, simply because it's freely available and everyone can be on the same page, but I would not be opposed to switching to the official rules of those committed to play actually own them.

If not, we'll stick with LL. If so, and if I do open the game up to the public to recruit, I could make owning the official rules a condition of play.


Thoughts?

[Zhym]

I do have the B/X ruleset. I think it was sub-$10 in PDF form. I love B/X for its pure old-school goodness and simplicity.

I wonder if the material differences between LL Basic and B/X could be listed in a single post. If so, I'd be happy to do that. Maybe I'll take a look.

[dmw71]

I do have the B/X ruleset. I think it was sub-$10 in PDF form. I love B/X for its pure old-school goodness and simplicity.

The PDF of this gem of a ruleset (and it's companion, X) can each be had for $4.99:

• D&D Basic Set Rulebook (B/X ed.) (Basic)
  D&D Expert Set Rulebook (B/X ed.) (Basic)

It's a steal, really, but I don't want to force anyone interested in playing of one of my games to pay for the necessary rules.

I wonder if the material differences between LL Basic and B/X could be listed in a single post. If so, I'd be happy to do that. Maybe I'll take a look.

There are a few message board threads that discuss the differences between the two (e.g. Differences between Labyrinth Lord + Basic D&D?), but not one I've found that outlines every difference.

They're subtle (outside of the few, commonly known "biggies" (e.g. cost of plate mail, clerics spells at 1st level, experience point requirements, etc...)), and one could easily play with just the LL rules, but I can't exactly refer someone using LL to page B12 in the Basic book which is my only reservation.

[dmw71]

This is another decent discussion about it: So how is Labyrinth Lord?

I've never really looked at the AEC (and don't really have any interest in doing so), but after skimming through the above, I noticed someone suggest using it for extra monsters, and extra treasures. That, I'm not necessarily opposed to. So, crap, now I may have to actually take a look at it.

[Zhym]

I wouldn't want to try to list all differences. But the number of differences that matter may be short. Basic only has 36 spells, so it couldn't take long to detail the differences there. And some of the differences, like monster stats and maybe even combat tables, should only matter to the DM.

In fact, outside of character stats and abilities, equipment lists, spell mechanics, and combat basics, almost everything else could be in the category of "relax and let the DM handle it."

[dmw71]

I'm equally comfortable running either, so I've created a poll ('Player's Preference') to gauge your preferences.

Let's see how the results come in.

[Bluehorse]

admittedly i only have a pdf of LL, i do like Zhym's suggestion of "Let the DM handle it". I'm good at following directions

[onlyme]

I do not have the b from bx. I do have the b from becmi and of course the ll pdf.

I would prefer to play with something I have the pdf from if at all possible. It makes rules research much, much easier. (Especially at work, where pulling up game manuals during a meeting seems to be frowned upon.)