OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

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Zorroroaster
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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#21 Post by Zorroroaster »

So you are allowing stat rolls using the dice roller, even though this allows for a player to game things until they get a set they like, by repeatedly clicking Nay? (And there are no records of the player having rerolled.)

Has this been fixed to only allow a limited number of rerolls? I remember that when this "exploit" was first discovered the rerolls were essentially unlimited.

Not that I care overly much, I'll roll one set and accept it as it is, as that's a big part of the fun for me. I don't care if others do choose to game things or not either, as their enjoyment in trying to max out rolls wouldn't impact me at all... Just thought I'd ask if it had changed at all.
()==[:::::::::::::>
[]-Orrin Lighthammer, Dwarven Gymnast-[] The Arch-Duchy of Vaul: A West Marches Labyrinth Lord Sandbox
[]-Arnulf The Banal, Manchild SuperMage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)
[]-Nai Tnam, Dwarven Cleric-[] Lair of the Black Druid - OSRIC
[]-Bronn Arnulfsen, Half-Orc Fighter-[] Valnwall, The Barrowmaze (LL)
[]-<[RIP]>Eduard d'Arnise, Elven Fighter/Mage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)

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Marullus
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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#22 Post by Marullus »

That was the theory, yes. No, I don't see any change in the die roller.

The argument above about player trust had a big impact on me. If I am willing to grant trust enough to allow players to transfer in stats from the old game, then I also should trust them in rolling a new PC.

The key factor of the die roller is that it rolls in sets. Mathematically, it is near impossible to come up with ALL good scores on a 3d6 method. I have sat there and re-rolled for 45 minutes to an hour, and frankly, I expect that at some point it gets boring and you pick.

There is also no method that can't be gamed here. So, better to accept trust and move forward. With how important stats are for the game, I don't blame someone for rejecting a truly bad set of rolls. I am okay with a natural desire to have one or a few good stats and there will always be some mediocre ones in a set, too - rolling in sets keeps some balance, and if something is egregious, I will reject it. That was my thought, at least. Too naïve?

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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#23 Post by Zorroroaster »

No, that sounds pretty realistic.

Look at it this way, the kind of player who will sit there rerolling for an hour to get a killer set of stats is unlikely to be interested in a game full of old grognards anyway. It would likely become obvious if they were min-maxers before long. :lol:
()==[:::::::::::::>
[]-Orrin Lighthammer, Dwarven Gymnast-[] The Arch-Duchy of Vaul: A West Marches Labyrinth Lord Sandbox
[]-Arnulf The Banal, Manchild SuperMage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)
[]-Nai Tnam, Dwarven Cleric-[] Lair of the Black Druid - OSRIC
[]-Bronn Arnulfsen, Half-Orc Fighter-[] Valnwall, The Barrowmaze (LL)
[]-<[RIP]>Eduard d'Arnise, Elven Fighter/Mage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)

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Zhym
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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#24 Post by Zhym »

It would take a long time to roll up killer stats with 3d6.

Example: The probability of rolling attributes of 12 or better is roughly 1/360. If you roll 250 sets of attributes, you'll have about a 50% chance of getting that or better.

So, yeah, if someone cares that much, okey-doke.

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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#25 Post by Starbeard »

The decision to allow the evil sub-alignment is a tough one. It's one thing to have an evil PC in a small group between close friends who all understand each other, but a different thing entirely when it's an online group open to anyone who's excited enough to play. Odium was definitely the evil sort of chaotic, but I tried very much to keep his evil actions directed at NPCs, and he was basically just a grumpy neutral toward other PCs. And in that case, if evil PCs essentially become neutral when other PCs are in the room, why allow evil alignments in the first place?

Hikuptah is really tricky, because both rulesets I'm using are RPG/wargame hybrids and actually presuppose a certain amount of player competition. Also, I estimate that about half of my players are coming from a Warhammer Battles background rather than an OSR background, so they naturally expect to pick sides and go every man for himself. The solution I've come up with is to mark PCs as 'PvE' or 'PvP' just like a MMORPG. The rule of thumb is that all characters are PvE unless the player says so, and PvE characters simply cannot be targeted for shenanigans: play nice, and if you're not sure about it, ask their permission and don't sweat it if it's turned down. It seems (so far) to work well.

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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#26 Post by AleBelly »


There is also no method that can't be gamed here. So, better to accept trust and move forward. With how important stats are for the game, I don't blame someone for rejecting a truly bad set of rolls. I am okay with a natural desire to have one or a few good stats and there will always be some mediocre ones in a set, too - rolling in sets keeps some balance, and if something is egregious, I will reject it. That was my thought, at least. Too naïve?
Actually, I disagree with the statement that there isn't a method that can't be gamed. Simply put in two macros for a West Marches character (STR [3d6] INT [3d6] WIS [3d6] and DEX [3d6] CON [3d6] CHR [3d6]) and roll them. Since it's linked to a character, the rolls will show up in the dire roller history.

Although unlikely, it is possible that a player can get a great set of 3d6 rolls. I'd hate to see those rejected. Why not just have a rule for when stat rolls are allowed? For instance, if the sum of all modifiers is less than -2 then the player gets to roll again. That way everyone performs chargen by a clear consistent set of rules. If it's taken on a case by case basis the players who whine more are more likely to get to re-roll their stats, which punishes those that go with the flow. Just my two cents.

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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#27 Post by Marullus »

The decision to allow the evil sub-alignment is a tough one. It's one thing to have an evil PC in a small group between close friends who all understand each other, but a different thing entirely when it's an online group open to anyone who's excited enough to play.
That's a good point, Starbeard. I wasn't aiming at the allowing of evil characters, but I suppose it is implicit in adjusting the PC alignments.

I don't particularly want evil play, but in a sandbox, I'm less adverse to allowing evil alignments. (I did love both Melvin and Odium sincerely, and think they qualified as Lawful Evil and Chaotic Evil respectively.) Players have control over who they allow into their character's expeditions, and thus over who is in each play-group. Evil characters value their own selfish aims, and if they ostracize the other characters, it impacts their own interests. This is functionally self-limiting in my experience (and I think applies to what you described with Odium).

That's the IC, though. The OOC needs to be clear and explicit. First, there's the rule that "the game is not in the town." No PvP can or should happen in the town itself. That means it only is a factor that comes into play if you get out on expeditions together, and thus the IC limiters above apply. When in town it is just roleplay, and that seems fair game. Second, this is a game and is meant to be fun for all. I firmly believe in the player compact - players need to be on the same terms regarding the actions and consequences of their characters. (This is inherent in the design of Burning Wheel and I bring it to other games.) As you said, "characters simply cannot be targeted for shenanigans: play nice, and if you're not sure about it, ask their permission and don't sweat it if it's turned down." Some GMs allow secret actions by PM and enforce unwilling action on other players - that's not my style and I don't intend to roll that way here. Players enjoying a game is the reason we're all here; I put that first.

Perhaps the allowing of evil characters and their governance needs a clear rule stated? How would you word it to capture the intent you've laid out?
Actually, I disagree with the statement that there isn't a method that can't be gamed. Simply put in two macros for a West Marches character (STR [3d6] INT [3d6] WIS [3d6] and DEX [3d6] CON [3d6] CHR [3d6]) and roll them. Since it's linked to a character, the rolls will show up in the dire roller history.
True, until the character is deleted. It is possible to make a character, roll the stats, then delete them if you're unhappy. Make a new PC with the same name and repeat until you have stat rolls you like.
Why not just have a rule for when stat rolls are allowed? For instance, if the sum of all modifiers is less than -2 then the player gets to roll again.
This is also possible, too. But I can't govern if they roll more than once, so I don't know if they re-rolled. If I set the rule at "roll if you want, quit when you're happy. Mathematically, it is hard to get all good stats," is that not equitable?

In all honesty, I usually do a point-buy system in my games because I hate random attribute rolling. Attributes impact things in major ways and can't ever be improved or changed - they don't "level up." I don't believe I can force someone to play with attributes that make them unhappy - they have the option to just not make the character. If I'm going to force a single-roll system and make people live with those attributes, then I feel like there should be a way for them to improve through gameplay, and by the book there is not.

Help me understand, what is the benefit of the single-roll system that I'm missing? I honestly have never really understood it. I understand the randomness helps arrive at a character you might not otherwise have conceived, but that is mitigated by being allowed to assign the attribute order.

If there's innate unfairness in re-rolling, would it be better to move to a point-buy system? (For example, divide 60 points over 6 attributes. You could be totally average, or you can lower some to enhance others, like taking an 18 and two 6s.)

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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#28 Post by Zorroroaster »

I suppose it all comes down to what one finds enjoyment in. Some view character creation as building something from the ground up, point buy works great for this. Others like the randomness involved in dicing for stats and may end up adjusting their play style to fit great or mediocre stats.

My feeling is randomness via dice rolling is inherent to the mechanics of the game, thus I should accept some measure of randomness from the outset.

If my character's demise can be clearly linked to an unlucky roll, then I find it makes sense to have their birth be equally indeterminate.

Of course, by that logic I would have to be advocating 3d6 straight down, no switching, no trades, no mulligans. That's pretty harsh, for most people.

I do have to say that my favourite characters were those who had unexpectedly bad stats that I had to work around.

Who's the greater hero - the fighter with the killer strength who has a natural advantage in every melee, or the unlikely weakling thief who against all odds rolls some lucky shots and manages to survive time and time again? Which one is more memorable? It's an interesting question.

You could allow both. Give the player who wants to point buy the option of doing so, but limit them in some other way. Give another player the option of 3d6 straight down with a bonus of more starting money, or a single magic item as a family heirloom, etc. Might make for interesting choices.
()==[:::::::::::::>
[]-Orrin Lighthammer, Dwarven Gymnast-[] The Arch-Duchy of Vaul: A West Marches Labyrinth Lord Sandbox
[]-Arnulf The Banal, Manchild SuperMage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)
[]-Nai Tnam, Dwarven Cleric-[] Lair of the Black Druid - OSRIC
[]-Bronn Arnulfsen, Half-Orc Fighter-[] Valnwall, The Barrowmaze (LL)
[]-<[RIP]>Eduard d'Arnise, Elven Fighter/Mage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)

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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#29 Post by AleBelly »

Marullus wrote:

Actually, I disagree with the statement that there isn't a method that can't be gamed. Simply put in two macros for a West Marches character (STR [3d6] INT [3d6] WIS [3d6] and DEX [3d6] CON [3d6] CHR [3d6]) and roll them. Since it's linked to a character, the rolls will show up in the dire roller history.
True, until the character is deleted. It is possible to make a character, roll the stats, then delete them if you're unhappy. Make a new PC with the same name and repeat until you have stat rolls you like.
Not if the stats are rolled by linking to an existing character. It eliminates the possibility you bring up (even if they have the same name you'll be able to see they have a different id number). Alternatively, you can have a player create a character and send you a link to a dummy roll. You can give the ok, then tell them to roll stats. If the dummy roll and stats don't show up under the same character, you know the rolls were fudged by creating a new one.
Marullus wrote:

Help me understand, what is the benefit of the single-roll system that I'm missing? I honestly have never really understood it. I understand the randomness helps arrive at a character you might not otherwise have conceived, but that is mitigated by being allowed to assign the attribute order.
Single roll randomness is one of the main attributes of the game. There is a thrill in the rare roll sets that give you a high-powered character. There is fun in playing a chump. Plus, I like building a character from the numbers...it spurs my creativity. I think this is just a matter of how one approaches the game, but I'm not a fan of the point buy system. Among other things, it encourages min-maxing, which I strongly dislike.

All that being said, the DM has to choose the rules and stick by the ones he/she favors. It's his/her game, after all.

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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#30 Post by Zorroroaster »

Hyde...I like it. :lol:
()==[:::::::::::::>
[]-Orrin Lighthammer, Dwarven Gymnast-[] The Arch-Duchy of Vaul: A West Marches Labyrinth Lord Sandbox
[]-Arnulf The Banal, Manchild SuperMage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)
[]-Nai Tnam, Dwarven Cleric-[] Lair of the Black Druid - OSRIC
[]-Bronn Arnulfsen, Half-Orc Fighter-[] Valnwall, The Barrowmaze (LL)
[]-<[RIP]>Eduard d'Arnise, Elven Fighter/Mage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)

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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#31 Post by KingOfCowards »

Wow, the gang's all here. Thanks for putting this together Marullus.
I couldn't let this conversation go without adding my 2 cents.

Character Creation: I personally like rolling stats per Alebelly's suggestion with a macro, at least it keeps everybody playing by the same rules. If we want to allow rerolling characters, we should state that up front and expect that stats will tend to be a little higher than normal.

I can understand that people don't always like being stuck with a character that has poor stats that they are forced to play with for the rest of their career, so I wanted to address another point made by Marullus - Incremental stat improvement.

I had been working on a system that had used stat improvement as part of leveling up, but its only been play-tested on a small level. Some people find this to be against the true nature of old-school D&D, but I think it would work at slow improvement of low-power characters over time. Mechanics are below in spoiler text if anybody is interested.
Improving ability scores

At each level up, your ability scores can improve. In this fashion, your character can grow from an ordinary man-at-arms to a great hero!
There are 2 aspects to this; random improvement and guided improvement.

a) Random Improvement

At each level, first roll 3d6 for each ability score (if your race has a bonus or penalty, apply it to this roll).
If the roll is equal to or greater than the stat, that ability score goes up by 1 point.

b) Guided Improvement

Each level, choose 1 ability score that DID NOT get randomly improved; you may improve that stat by a fixed amount, based on how high it currently is:

3-6 raise 2 points
7-11 raise 1 point
12-14 raise 1/2 point
15-16 raise 1/3 point
17 raise 1/4 point
18 raise 1/6 point

You may not choose to improve a stat that is already at 19.
Fractional points do not have any effect until it becomes a new whole number.
If any ability score with fractional points is randomly improved (at a later level), all fractional points are lost...the score simply improves by 1 point.
I personally like using 19 as a cap for a truly exceptional ability. There might be 2,000 people in the world that qualify for 18 charisma, but there are only a few that have the same level of Charisma as JFK or the intelligence of Albert Einstein.

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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#32 Post by Marullus »

Thank you all for participating in this brainstorming. I really appreciate all the dialog and debate.
Zorroroaster wrote:Hyde...I like it. :lol:
I thought he'd make the best bartender. ;)

"HAH? Hah? You like that ale?"
AleBelly wrote:You can have a player create a character and send you a link to a dummy roll. You can give the ok, then tell them to roll stats. If the dummy roll and stats don't show up under the same character, you know the rolls were fudged by creating a new one.
True, that does seem viable. Thanks! I am glad we have that option.

So, we have a mechanism for ensuring a single-roll. I'm still dubious about enforcing it. I'll consider this below.
AleBelly wrote:Single roll randomness is one of the main attributes of the game.
True. That is a major point.
AleBelly wrote:There is a thrill in the rare roll sets that give you a high-powered character.
Can't disagree with that. I literally danced around the room when my rolls came up for Hellebore in your game.

It isn't the high end that concerns me, but the inequity of the low end. Is it worth forcing another player to live with a bad set of rolls so I can feel the thrill of a superior character?
AleBelly wrote:There is fun in playing a chump. Plus, I like building a character from the numbers...it spurs my creativity.
I agree, and am comfortable rewarding this. Encouraging someone to accept and play a rolled disadvantage is good.

It is the stick, rather than carrot approach that concerns me in this online environment. So, we allow only one roll. It comes up bad and the player is unhappy. At a gaming table there are additional incentives - he likely wants to play with this group of friends and that's cool. Online, not so much - they can go to any game on any forum if they want. So, what do I do as GM? If the rule is only one roll, do I let him delete and make a different PC? If so, how is that different than a re-roll? Do I tell him he's not allowed to join the game unless he uses those stats? In that case, I potentially lost a player.

I am not comfortable with that as the logical outcome. Some players are happy to take any roll and make a concept from it. Others have a concept they're itching to play and invest in and desire for the roll to match. Why would I lose a player because they have a concept in mind for their roleplay?

It seems I need a middle ground. I want players happy with their characters and willing to invest in them, which is what spurs RP. I want to incentivize players willing to have low scores. I don't want rules that disenfranchise players to the point that they might leave for another game. I just want to explore incentives, not disincentives.
AleBelly wrote:I think this is just a matter of how one approaches the game, but I'm not a fan of the point buy system. Among other things, it encourages min-maxing, which I strongly dislike.
True. A game system must be built with a point-buy system in mind, and D&D retroclones clearly are not. We take this off the table.
Zorroroaster wrote:Give another player the option of 3d6 straight down with a bonus of more starting money, or a single magic item as a family heirloom, etc. Might make for interesting choices.

So, here's a proposal. We already have a curious and potent house-rule from Keehnelf in the existence of Heroic Items. The fact that magical items naturally occur in the world based on the potent imprint of the souls of their users has several implications for our game and the ubiquitousness of magical occurrence. Low-level magical characteristics now manifest on normal items, and thus occur in the wider population. This is a major shift from them being the intentional works of high-level magic users and only found in the hands of those with a minimal degree of separation from that source. It is possible to have a low-level hero in any town, in any family, who's deeds have catalyzed on a key artifact, or to have a traumatic death which results in a lasting manifestation. Such items would clearly be valued family heirlooms, and likely pass as aid to those venturing forth from the family who need them.

  • Create your character in the Unseen Servant die roller: http://www.unseenservant.com/
  • On the Characters tab, choose Create a New Character. Name your PC, and put in Campaign ID number 417.
  • Next to your character's name, click the big gold die under the "Roll Stats" button. Roll using the 3d6 method. Assign the stats in the order of your choice. There is no point-buy option. Click "Aye." (Players are encouraged to use the initial roll, and rewarded if they accept a low result (see below). Players are permitted to re-roll by clicking "Nay" if there is a specific concept desired. Remember, no roll is perfect and flaws are fun to play, too. Pick a set and move forward.)
  • Once the roll is accepted, add up all six attributes. It the total is higher than 66, proceed as is. If the total is between 54 and 66, one of your starting equipment items is a family heirloom with 2001xp. If the total is below 54, you have 4002xp on one heirloom or 2001xp each on two heirloom items. See the Family Heirloom rules for details. Alternately, Magic users may also use this to begin with a larger spell book, spending 2001xp for another initial first level spell or 4001xp for a second level spell.


Family Heirloom rules:
These rules are governed by the Heroic Items house rules and apply to starting equipment for certain new characters. Someone in your family or hometown was once known for heroic deeds, and/or experienced a horrible and traumatic demise. These experiences leave a lasting, semi-magical impression on the physical objects involved and sometimes are strong enough to manifest as tangible magical abilities. For each heirloom item, follow the Heroic Items rules to determine an appropriate effect. Then write up a brief description of the person who's actions manifested this effect, the circumstances of those actions, and how the item came into your character's possession.

Examples:
  • A large-knobbed wooden cane (club +1). Great grandfather Bullroarer Took led the defense of Hobbiton from goblins, smiting the head of the goblin chieftain clean-off with a blow from his favorite walking stick. He told the tale religiously, continuing to carry the cane for the rest of his life. The cane was passed down and entrusted to me when I ventured forth to find my fortune. 2001xp.
  • Mother's lamp. Growing up in the ruins of a drafty castle, we dared too far. My brother was taken in his sleep by the touch of a ghost, driving my mother to grief and despair. Every night she placed the lamp by my bed and prayed over it, not daring to leave until the morning light lest she lose another child. Eventually, her grief overcame her and she died, lamp still in-hand, leaving me an orphan forced to go out into the world. The lamp is all I have to remember her by. Effects: For 2001xp, the lamp lasts the night, never running out of oil until extinguished. (It must be refilled before being relit again normally.) For 4001xp, it also functions as Protection from Evil spell while held.


Thoughts and feedback?

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KingOfCowards
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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#33 Post by KingOfCowards »

Looks good to me. The heirloom option should create some interesting characters.

BTW, I really like the pantheon you have so far.

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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#34 Post by Zorroroaster »

It's a neat twist. It encourages players to keep a low stat character and hopefully balances out their agency somewhat without breaking the core math. And, like a sleep spell...that heirloom or artifact may only be of use at low levels and become somewhat redundant as the character progresses, minimizing any long-term impact of all these items kicking around.

Could be cool.

As far as stat increase - it's an interesting idea. I play in one game that every few levels allows you to choose a stat and dice to increase it. If you roll a d20 higher than the stat you can bump it by one. I haven't seen it in action yet but it'll be curious to see what happens when that time comes. Not sure if it's a game breaker or not.
()==[:::::::::::::>
[]-Orrin Lighthammer, Dwarven Gymnast-[] The Arch-Duchy of Vaul: A West Marches Labyrinth Lord Sandbox
[]-Arnulf The Banal, Manchild SuperMage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)
[]-Nai Tnam, Dwarven Cleric-[] Lair of the Black Druid - OSRIC
[]-Bronn Arnulfsen, Half-Orc Fighter-[] Valnwall, The Barrowmaze (LL)
[]-<[RIP]>Eduard d'Arnise, Elven Fighter/Mage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)

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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#35 Post by Fulci »

Hi, everybody! Marullus invited me, so... here I am!

I have no strong opinions on stat generation systems, I can go and "roll" with anything I roll up. Being compensated for low ratings with magic equipment is a great idea, especially given the Heroic Items system! It's something that I find very inspiring. Leveling up your sword, naming it, writing stories around it and writing stories with it.

Okay, back to digesting the rules & setting descriptions.
G A M E S :
Running Vaults & Wastelands [Fallout]
Isaiah Bartlett in That Which Should Not Be [CoC]
Ingrid Esthof in The Horror at Briarsgate [1e]
Jónas Gillman in The Sinister Secret of Saltmarsh [1e]

I N A C T I V E : (
Ballar Uh in Dungeonesque [LL/AEC]
Favrick in The Rise of Smaug [BW]

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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#36 Post by Marullus »

Welcome!

I clarified some specifics in the Heroic items rules and added some location details in Gaul. Interested in thoughts.

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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#37 Post by Zorroroaster »

Welcome!
()==[:::::::::::::>
[]-Orrin Lighthammer, Dwarven Gymnast-[] The Arch-Duchy of Vaul: A West Marches Labyrinth Lord Sandbox
[]-Arnulf The Banal, Manchild SuperMage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)
[]-Nai Tnam, Dwarven Cleric-[] Lair of the Black Druid - OSRIC
[]-Bronn Arnulfsen, Half-Orc Fighter-[] Valnwall, The Barrowmaze (LL)
[]-<[RIP]>Eduard d'Arnise, Elven Fighter/Mage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)

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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#38 Post by Zorroroaster »

There's a lot to like there. I like how the item grows with you, how it becomes an essential part of the character's story, how it leaves a legacy behind after a particular personage has faded and gone. It provides explanation for how these legendary items came to be - not just that they might be imbued by magic from some wizard for hire, but that they earned their reputations through great deeds.

Look at it this way, a musical instrument gets better the more someone skilled plays it and learns it's particular idiosyncrasies. It'll sound better in the hands of someone who has played and grown with it than just some other player.

I think the process should include a naming of the item. It's just not special or unique unless it has a title of its own.
()==[:::::::::::::>
[]-Orrin Lighthammer, Dwarven Gymnast-[] The Arch-Duchy of Vaul: A West Marches Labyrinth Lord Sandbox
[]-Arnulf The Banal, Manchild SuperMage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)
[]-Nai Tnam, Dwarven Cleric-[] Lair of the Black Druid - OSRIC
[]-Bronn Arnulfsen, Half-Orc Fighter-[] Valnwall, The Barrowmaze (LL)
[]-<[RIP]>Eduard d'Arnise, Elven Fighter/Mage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)

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Marullus
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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#39 Post by Marullus »

Zorroroaster wrote: I think the process should include a naming of the item. It's just not special or unique unless it has a title of its own.
Let's discuss that: I am curious for opinions and have mixed feelings.

I know some folks like naming their weapons, like Smurfgrill the longbow. But on the other hand, much of the notoriety is from the owner. It could just be "Orrin's Hammer" rather than forcing Orrin to name it. Given the Heroic items system, is it better to be Smurfgrill or the Bow of Lug? If we just leave it "player's choice" is there any governance required?

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Zorroroaster
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Re: OOC Chatter - Pre-Launch Discussion

#40 Post by Zorroroaster »

No, that's very true. I just thought it would lose some of the flavour if someone had invested time and money (and XP) only to pull out their legendary...Spear +1!

That's not heroic, that's accounting! :lol:

But I totally agree that much of it comes from the owner, and also the deeds it accomplishes.

Maybe it should just be a discussion between owner and DM... Something basic can be called Orrin's Sword, but as it grows in fame it might become Goblincleaver or something.

Look at it this way- assigning XP to something means treating it like a PC which also earns experience. So it should be unique in ways other than raw stats.

It could also have multiple names, were it a storied and legendary item.
()==[:::::::::::::>
[]-Orrin Lighthammer, Dwarven Gymnast-[] The Arch-Duchy of Vaul: A West Marches Labyrinth Lord Sandbox
[]-Arnulf The Banal, Manchild SuperMage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)
[]-Nai Tnam, Dwarven Cleric-[] Lair of the Black Druid - OSRIC
[]-Bronn Arnulfsen, Half-Orc Fighter-[] Valnwall, The Barrowmaze (LL)
[]-<[RIP]>Eduard d'Arnise, Elven Fighter/Mage-[] The Lone City in the Wildlands (OSRIC)

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